That really is progress, Mulan. So, I take it there are no active witnesses left in your family, or they're never discussed (or both)? That is serious progress - that you were JWs and your grandson has no clue of their existence. "Bad church" is definitely a perfect response to his query!
Madame Quixote
JoinedPosts by Madame Quixote
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14
A very dangerous belief!!
by Gill inwe were unfortunate enough to be invited to spend some time with some of my jw relatives the other day.
my husbands jw relatives totally shun us but, my side of the family occassionally 'stoop' to allow us into their presence once in a while.
(a totally worthless occassion in which no 'real' conversation is permitted!).
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A very dangerous belief!!
by Gill inwe were unfortunate enough to be invited to spend some time with some of my jw relatives the other day.
my husbands jw relatives totally shun us but, my side of the family occassionally 'stoop' to allow us into their presence once in a while.
(a totally worthless occassion in which no 'real' conversation is permitted!).
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Madame Quixote
It seems to me you could have had a fascinating and enlightening conversation with the cousin's child about what she believed was "bad" and why, if not for the typically repressive environment of a JW family gathering.
The kid is unconsciously screaming for help, by using the words "not allowed", rather than saying, "we're footstep followers of Christ," the way most adult JWs would do (or some mature variation on the same theme).
"Not allowed" suggests repression and compliance, rather than belief; maybe belief comes later; I don't know . . . maybe there's hope for this child to get out, as long as she still sees it as "not allowed" instead of "we believe."
The distinction between deep repression and profound arrogance is a fine one, especially in conversations with kids who are the biggest victims of such brainwashing.
The parents are arrogant and repressed; and the kids probably are too; however, often times, when angered by a JW family incident or situation, I find it very difficult to remind myself that deep insecurity and deprivations breed the cycle of arrogant oppression.
I believe that the insecurity of such deprivations feeds the arrogant repressiveness and is the core of Fundamentalism and cultic ideas that cause people to neglect their own and their childrens' deepest needs, often times for many generations.
In many respects, it turns off the sympathy and empathy switches and short-circuits compassion for others, as well as for the self.
Congratulations on getting out of that terrible cycle, Gill.
I think it is very lucky that you are able to maintain contact with your JW family, although I do agree that it feels like worthless conversations are taking place when you're with them. If you keep your cool, you might be able to reach some of them, in gracious, delicate ways, especially since occasionally you do have contact.
What a sad state of affairs it is to have an entire family locked into this cult, I do know. I am glad you have your husband, and hope you both are somehow able to exude happiness, and be yourselves when around your poor, repressed JW family. As long as we are outside the cult, we have choices they will never have; we need to make them see that without being overly confrontational. Best wishes to you in that effort, if you choose to make it.
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Dr. Jekyll and Mr. Hyde.
by scout575 in"behold, the lord god...he shall feed his flock like a shepherd: he shall gather the lambs with his arm, and carry them in his bosom, and shall gently lead those that are with young.
" ( isaiah 40:10,11 ).
"for the indignation of the lord is upon all nations, and his fury upon all their armies: he hath utterly destroyed them, he hath delivered them to the slaughter.
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Madame Quixote
Different writers = different messages. See the book Who Wrote The Bible by Elliot Friedman. It explains a lot of that 'schizo' stuff. There are several different versions of the Bible - versions written by a number of scribes and wed together by different redactors over the years; it is pretty well-researched and documented by Friedman and other bible scholars, particularly with regard to the Old Testament (but also good research on New T, as well). Of course, we know this innately (that the Bible is written by more than one person), but it's nice to have scholarly research from experts in Hebrew and Greek to back up our gut feelings in the matter. It's also fun to throw it in the face of fundies and JWs once in a while, too!
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My Mom passed away today.
by Finally-Free inafter a lenthy illness, 10 years in total, my mother, margaret stecko, passed away peacefully today surrounded by family.
she was 84, and leaves behind 3 children, 5 grandchildren, and 8 great grandchildren.
she was a jw but never shunned me.
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Madame Quixote
((((Walter)))) So sorry for your loss, and for the suffering because of the sadness of the past. Hope you can find some happy memories, too. Best wishes and healing to you and your family.
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would you all consider this a serious threat????
by annalice inlet me start by saying that i have posted here before about my wacko sister -in-law.
this time it is bad.
we recieved a phone call from my husbands father on friday night asking about how we were and what we were up to ,no biggie just odd since its only maybe the second time in over a year that he has called.
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Madame Quixote
Let professionals handle this. Law enforcement officers and the USPS are better equipped to enforce the law and to let the offender know you're serious about it; and that you aren't willing to tolerate such invasive, threatening actions from her.
Most JWs may think the way she thinks, but only real whackos with impulse control issues actually act the way she has acted. She has definitely made provocative and threatening statements and has done so by illegal means. Because of this, I feel concerned that the original poster has not yet responded here; I hope that you are alright.
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Another Milestone - Christmas Eve Services.
by AK - Jeff inheaded out the door and looking forward to it.. jeff .
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Madame Quixote
I'm glad to hear that you have no trepidation about attending church now. Christmas services are wonderful, I think. There is little more joy than the kind of singing and music that Christmas inspires.
I was about 19 or 20 when I first attended a church for a Christmas service (about 4 or 5 years after I was disfellowshipped). I went with someone I was dating and with his family. It was in an Episcopalian church near Biltmore in Asheville, NC, (http://www.allsoulscathedral.org/). It was stunningly beautiful in every way - musically and visually. We wanted to clap every time the choir sang. I think we got stoned before the service, naughty us! I guess I thought it was going to be a joke to go to church for Christmas, but it turned out to be seriously enjoyable; I was so stunned by it all; didn't know when to kneel and sit and stand and such; all that kneeling was a trip, but kinda' funny.
The other services I've attended for Christmas were in the UU church locally (and never got stoned for those; thank goodness!) I attended one out-of-town this year at the Eno River UUFW in Durham (http://www.eruuf.org/campus.htm). It was absolutely lovely. We did the candle-lighting thing at the end, too.
The basic theme of the service was that "every night a child is born, is a holy night", (based upon the words of Sophia Lyon-Fahs), and that we are all children of such a holy night, in typical UU fashion. I think that, "every night a child is born, is a holy night," is a common UU Christmas theme. Sermon transcripts: http://www.eruuf.org/sermons.htm
It was lovely and made me cry, as usual.
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74 Degrees Today, 1 week before Christmas!
by Madame Quixote inno chance of a "white christmas" here:.
http://www.weather.com/weather/tenday/usnc0760?from=36hr_fcst10daylink_undeclared .
well, somehow, i'll have to "muddle through.".
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Madame Quixote
No chance of a "white Christmas" here:
http://www.weather.com/weather/tenday/USNC0760?from=36hr_fcst10DayLink_undeclared
Well, somehow, I'll have to "muddle through."
Off to shave my legs and put on that cute white tennis skort and short-sleeved shirt for work (and xmas shopping later).
Merry Christmas, all!
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Is the Watchtower really this decietful? Say it aint so. Really?
by icocer ini found this page that list what they believe are their top 10 deceptive quotes in the "should you believe in the trinity" booklet.
the site is trinitarian.
my itention is not to prove or disporve the trinity, it is to find out if the watchtower is really this decietful.
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Madame Quixote
Yes. I learned something new about their deceitfulness, reading this thread. I'll check out the website you posted, too.
So far, I have found a couple of extremely destructive theories of the Jehovah's Witnesses: refusing blood transfusions and disfellowshipping/shunning.
In my opinion, the worst of their deceptions, so far, is their writing/quoting on the blood issue.
Attorney Kerry Louderback-Wood has written a long, but very insightful article about that. She exposes many, many of the Society's misrepresentations, (of medical and academic material), used to support their cultic beliefs about refusing blood transfusions. The article is entitled "Jehovah's Witnesses, Blood Transfusions And The Tort Of Misrepresentation," originally published in The Journal Of Church And State, last year. It can be viewed at the AJWRB site, here:
A great deal of the criticism is directed at the Blood Booklet, but also includes some references to other articles and literature regarding the blood/transfusion issue.
It is well worth one's time and trouble to read the entire article (and to share it with medical professionals with whom you are acquainted).
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1979
by Blueblades inthis was the year that jesus no longer was the mediator for the great crowd of other sheep.
jesus became the mediator of only the 144,000. question i have, if this was true, how could the brothers of the other sheep be used to open and close the meetings with prayer when you had to end that prayer in the name of jesus who would then act as mediator and bring your prayer to jehovah?
if jesus was no longer our mediator, then we could no longer be used to pray in his name.
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Madame Quixote
Regarding John 10:16 about the "other sheep" who are "not of this sheepfold," who's to say those "other sheep" aren't Muslims? After all, they too belonged to the "Abrahamic Covenant," and certainly have a more legitimate claim than the JWs.
Or maybe the "other sheep" are Jews? Or Hindus or Catholics or Buddhists, or all of organized religion, outside of the JWs?
One can speculate all day and night about such scripture, but all it is is speculation; and we know what the Society says about speculation! Oh boy! Now that's some hypocritical tripe, isn't it - to criticize members for "speculating" about scripture when that's all the Society does anyway, and then they change the speculations and call it new light!
I've got some "new light" for them: it's called a laserized lobotomy. It might help focus on something more sensible.
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I'm one of the EVIL SLAVE
by Amazing inbasd on my comment to another post titled "1979," i thought that this would make an interesting separate topic.. a little history: many here are aware that i was an ms and then elder and of the anointed while a jw.
i openly professed anointing for 20-years of the 27-years i was associated with the watchtower.
since that time, i have totally and completely renounced all but one watchtower doctrine.
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Madame Quixote
Good for you, Jim Whitney!
So, I take it, no women have ever belonged to the evil slave class, huh?